Biotest

Which Peri-WO Supplement to Take?


#1

I currently use Surge Recovery peri-workout. However, unless I do conditioning of any kind I often feel a bit sluggish after I take it recently. I’ve been taking it exclusively since November. Before that, I went on a low carb diet that dropped me 20 lbs in 2 months. Before that I was Surge Workout Fuel before and during followed by Recovery After.

I do recover well from workouts from this, but I don’t like the body composition results from it. I started out a little high on the dosage, but turned it down a notch. I have it at no more than 4 scoops before during and after (was at 6 at one point), and that is only one day. Others are 2 or 3. I’ve even started doing more conditioning and it hasn’t seemed to slow down some of the body comp results that i’ve had problems with.

What supplements on this sight could help me with recovery similarly without the effects I am experiencing with Surge Recovery?

I’m 286 lbs and don’t want to hit three hundred unless its with something I want to see in the mirror. Diets good. Some snacking or cheat here and there. No more than 3 or 4 a week.


#2

Clarifying on the diet:

Bulkers’s Omelette (Frittata for me)
6 egg whites
3 whole omega 3 eggs
cut up green and red peppers (total of one pepper)
2tbsp of grass fed butter
Havarti cheese to top it off
4 oz lean turkey

piece of fruit

2 chicken breasts
1/2 cup jasmine rice
veggies
2 tbsp natural pb

13 oz steak
veggies
spinach salad
bread with olive oil
1/2 cup jasmine rice

Assorted whey shakes.

Snacks I may have would be some chips here and there, no more than twice a week, mother likes to bake so I have a cookie or two once a week, if that

cheat meals: Dad makes good homemade pizza, maybe subway sandwich, breakfast burrito at work after missing breakfast once in three weeks, cereal for quick breakfast.

6’5" 286. Shoot for about 5000 cals a day, but no more. I found more puts it on real fast.
350g-400g+ in protein, <250 g carbs a day, highest carb meal is post workout, it isnt only carb meal. around 300 g fat a day


#3

Several things here:

First, it’s very difficult to get fat on specialized workout drinks unless your training is lacking and those extra nutrients are un-earned. I doubt that’s true for you. The weight-gain issue is most-likely caused by something else.

Second, if you’re eating crappy foods several times per week – cookies, cereal, fast food, and the other junk you listed – don’t you think your fat-gain issue might have more to do with that than workout drinks? You’re simply eating too much. And you can’t out-train poor food choices. Now, you are a big guy and require more calories than a short 160-pound guy, but you’re clearly overdoing it if you can’t stop edging toward 300 pounds.

Also, while Surge Recovery was great for its time, we’ve greatly upgraded peri-workout formulas with the introduction of <a href="http://www.t-nation.com/store/products/plazma"target=“new”>Plazma. Plazma contains nutrient-partitioning, functional carbohydrates (highly branched cyclic dextrin). They are thermic in nature, meaning they help with fat loss instead of contributing to it. And of course it speeds recovery and muscle gains.

So, two main suggestions for you: clean up your diet (mom and dad won’t be too offended if you tell them you’re doing it to be healthier), then upgrade your workout drink to Plazma, or at least Anaconda.

If you’ve always had issues with carbs and easy fat gain, consider using <a href="http://www.t-nation.com/store/products/indigo-3g"target=“new”>Indigo-3G, which fixes the dysfunctional fat cells and nutrient uptake mechanisms that cause these problems. There’s a package deal available that contains both of those supplements. You can check it out here: <a href="http://www.t-nation.com/store/packages/plazma-reactive-pump-stack"target=“new”>Plazma Reactive Pump Stack

But step #1 is to get your diet in order. You don’t have to go on an extreme low-carb diet and start doing tons of cardio, just remove the obvious junk and plan meals better so you aren’t stuck with fast-food or cafeteria burritos.

One last thing: can you post a photo? That would really help, especially since you’re a bit of an outlier (being very tall) and it’s sometimes difficult to factor in scale weight when offering advice.


#4

I’m moving out this week so I can focus on my diet a little better. I make sure if I have a cookie or have my dad’s pizza its after a workout and not just any regular day, but I suppose if they are buying those it would be hard for anyone to completely ignore.

I work in an industry that is very volatile and I could be given twelve hour shifts tomorrow or be fired the next day so I want keep costs around $200 a month +/- $50, would that be doable with some of these? I have the photos up and I apologize but it may be a good thing they are a little blurry.


#5

back shot


#6

side shot


#7

Neck 17.5"
Chest 49.5"
Belly Buuton 40"
Waist 37.5"
Seat 44"
Thighs 28"
Arms 17"
Calves 17.5"

I think I’m around 20% BF and would like get down to 12% or so and decide to cut more or maintain. However, I think if I do this well enough, I could lose very little strength. At least that is my hope.


#8

Just as we suspected, since you’re 6’5" you carry 286 pounds pretty well. Your problem area is mainly belly / love handle, and some of the extra body fat appears sub-abdominal. The good news is, that fat storage area is pretty easy to reduce; the bad news is this type of fat storage is the worst for your health: diabetes, heart issues etc. But you’re young and can get rid of it quickly.

Instead of focusing on weight and body fat percentage, watch those tape measurements, especially the ones around the belly. Measure again at the biggest part just below the belly button. In other words, keep measuring until you find the most mentally painful measurement. That’s the area we want to see go down, though fat loss often “starts” higher up and works its way down to the problem area (or at least it seems that way in the mirror) so measuring just below the pecs in the upper ab area is a good place to watch too.

Sounds like you’re taking control of your diet, so that’ll get things moving in the right direction. I always suggest that people who struggle with body fat drop wheat and liquid milk. This will get rid of the bloat, make it easier to control diet (kills most cravings and false hunger signals), and speeds fat loss.

Your supplement budget should probably focus on upgrading your peri-workout nutrition, but given your primary fat loss goal and budget, I’m going to give you another option that I think will really accelerate you to where you want to be. I’d suggest <a href="http://www.t-nation.com/store/products/mag-10"target=“new”>MAG-10 used in a way to greatly accelerate fat loss.

Using a serving during training and a serving after training, then replace two solid meals with it per day. This is a modified Pulse Fast style of plan. You’ll still have a couple of healthy solid meals per day. Evening is a good time for one depending on your work schedule. Let me know when you typically train and we’ll work out a plan for you if this sounds good.

It’s a little on the extreme side, but at your age and with your goals, let’s scorch the extra body fat quickly and get it over with. You have a lot of potential with your physique: you’re big and tall, but not lanky. Lots of beast potential there.


#9

Right now, my bp is around 60, good/low blood pressure, haven’t gotten fasting glucose or cholesterol checked so far, but that doesn’t mean they’ll be any good in five or ten years, so especially when you put it that way I am definitely in.

Primarily why my diet has some cheats and unfortunate ‘wiggle room’ (in addition to living at home) is because I’m running Juggernaut right now and those failure sets really tax my CNS so if I get some of those extra bad things, I don’t feel as drained. Dopamine at it’s best, huh?

I can afford the Plazma and Indigo-3G. It is a little up there for my price range, but I want to get serious about my diet. I already spend about $150 a month and that’s on stuff I probably don’t need and doesn’t include some extra spending on food at lunch while at work.

I like working with juggernaut. I enjoyed 5/3/1 as well but didn’t like it as much. Would I be able to use either of those if I were to try and lose the weight? I also have a prowler, tires, sledges, sleds, atlas stone, and farmer’s handles. Could I use those? (on a lighter basis perhaps)

I’ve already started to develop plans for my diet. I’ll be able to implement them better once I’m moved out (and my birthday is this week, so I have two ‘dinners’). Thinking 3 wholes eggs (Omega 3) and 5 egg whites, 2 tbsp pb, piece of fruit and a veggie for breakfast followed by nuts as a midmorning snack.

I would imagine keeping calories somewhat the same as before (maybe down to 4500) but with a proper diet and peri workout regiment I should get down to a healthier weight and physique. Much appreciated Chris!


#10

If you’d like to list the other supplements you use, we’d be glad to look them over and help you budget a better stack. Often we’re able to find supplements that are just eating up your budget because 1. they’re worthless or 2. they’re good, but not the best for your current goals.

From the sound of it, your money is best spent on peri-workout nutrition. The <a href="http://www.t-nation.com/store/packages/plazma-reactive-pump-stack"target=“new”>Plazma Reactive Pump Stack would give you Indigo-3G and Plazma and save you a few bucks with the package deal.

If your theory is right - the demanding program is challenging your recovery and making you seek out cheat foods - then that stack will have a three-fold effect: repairing dysfunctional fat cells and nutrient uptake mechanisms (leading to fat loss and better carb tolerance), killing the cravings since your workout will be properly fueled, and of course increasing recovery and muscle gains.

Improve your solid food choices and any unwanted body fat should peel off nicely and without the “suffering” of a more severe diet.

There’s no doubt that stack can help you with any training program. I’d suggest <a href="http://www.t-nation.com/store/articles/reactive-pump-program"target=“new”>Reactive Pump. Meadows includes some diet recs too in that plan. You can download it for free and check it out.


#11

Flameout and ON Gold Standard Whey. I generally have the shake around bedtime, but if I manage to eat a little better/more protein over the course of the day, I shouldn’t need it. Besides, I think it keeps me up a bit and/or gets me up at night and I wake up at 5 am, so cutting that out may give me better sleep. I go through 2-3 bottles a month for the Flameout. Sometimes I’ll have two with whatever I’m having, other times it’s four or five. It’s about another $40 or so on the protein and then about 1.5 surge recoveries a month

$40 on whey
$60-90 on Flameout
$60-80 on Surge


#12

<a href="http://www.t-nation.com/store/products/flameout"target=“new”>Flameout is always a good choice as a foundational supplement for health. Plus it makes your joints feel great. Four capsules per day is all most people will ever need due to it being highly concentrated. So, about one-and-a-fourth bottle per month will do the trick and stretch your budget.

You can probably do without the extra whey with improved food choices. And whey isn’t the best choice anyway before bed. A micellar casein blend is better for nighttime (or a pulse of Mag-10.)

And of course Plazma can replace your Surge Recovery once you run out.


#13

Hey Chris, thanks for getting me on the right track and taking more accountability with me diet. My training, as of this coming Monday will be some of the Reactive Pump program and other things I changed for myself. I also am using the Plazma, MAG-10, Indigo, and FINiBARs.

I go for ~4500 cals a day and all my carbs are periworkout or after taking an Indigo.

Idea on the det
Breakfast -
10 egg whites
3 while omega 3 eggs
1 tbsp of butter
2tbsp of natural pb
handful of veggies
coffee (a lot of cream)

Snack - MAG-10 and some nuts

Lunch (w Indigo)
Chicken Breast (12-16 oz)
Veggies
Sweet Potato/Baked Potato
Handful of almonds

Peri: MAG-10 and FINIbar

500ml Plazma w/ Indigo

rest of Plazma for workout
MAG-10 pulse directly after

Dinner
Chicken Breast (~12-16 0z, could be lean beef or finish, but mostly chicken)
Vegetables
Jasmine Rice 3/4 cup

Mag -10 pulls
4 egg whites, one whole egg
2 tbsp nat pb


#14

Looks like a solid plan. Keep us posted!