Biotest

Plazma Science?


#1

I would like some clarification on the mystery surrounding Plazma. I have yet to use this product, but it seems to have ‘magical’ properties. I am wondering if someone can shed some light on this product. I am wondering if the reason most are having great results is: they have never used a pre, during and post protein/enhancement shakes in the past and in addition their normal protocol was a very inept whey concentrate shake post workout.

I have use Hydrolyzed whey (range from 520 Daltons to 1800 Daltons) in the past with a sucrose/dextrose carbohydrate source in the past with great results. Recently I have been using a Hydrolyzed ceasin (made of mostly all di and tri peptides under 300 Daltons) with dextrose as my main carb source.

First question, will I see much better results with Plazma?
Second question, why so much water with Plazma?


#2

Not “magical”, but for this 48 year old body, it works.

I have used the old “Anaconda” protocol, SWF and MAG-10 combo, a competitors similar product, my own concoction (hydrolysed casein, dextrose, malate, etc), whey and dextrose, etc. Plazma is just that effective.

Plazma might seem expensive, but you truly get what you pay for.

A superior product that lets me work out 4-6 times a week without having to recuperate for two weeks…


#3

Most <a href="http://www.t-nation.com/store/products/plazma"target=“new”>Plazma users are former users of our previous workout nutrition products, like Surge, and they’ll usually tell you that Plazma is far superior and noticeably better. Of course, if someone has never used workout nutrition and they go straight to Plazma, their results seem “magical” because they have filled in a major gap with the best possible supplement.

There are many supplements and ingredients being sold out there that claim to be the same as what’s in Plazma. But the fact is, there is simply no way for that to be true. Why? Because they charge less than what the quality raw ingredients cost. Now, you tell me: are they running a charity or are they doing some funny business with their labels and ingredient claims? I think this is one reason why people find Plazma and other Biotest supplements to be so superior and work so much better: you’re actually getting large amounts of the best ingredients. With other supplements, you’re getting waste products claiming to be the real thing, or they’re using the quality ingredients but not enough of them to have an effect on the body (or they’re adding “filler” and not claiming that on the label - a popular ruse of cheaper supplements, especially proteins.)

As for the water content, Tim Patterson has studied and tested this extensively: the amount of water called for is the amount that’s needed for you to get the most out of the supplement. Again, I suppose many supplement companies would not let the customer know this because they know that some people won’t want to drink that much. Tim would rather you get the best results possible, so the water amounts called for reflect that.


#4

[quote]burndaddy0 wrote:

First question, will I see much better results with Plazma?
[/quote]

Yes - cyclic dextrin really makes that much of a difference, plus when you factor in the rest of the formula you just can’t fully mimic it on your own.

Everyone at my gym who has switched to cyclic dextrin has noticed a huge difference, and then those that switched to Plazma noticed an even bigger difference.

[quote]burndaddy0 wrote:
Second question, why so much water with Plazma?
[/quote]

With the sodium content of Plazma you need plenty of fluid so that the sodium can facilitate the peptides in most efficiently.


#5

I have recently switched from MAG-10 pulses to exclusive Plazma pulses and love it. I just felt I needed more clean carbs and the kind and amount in Plazma (cyclic dextrin and isomaltulose) is so convenient. I was really sick not that long ago, and Plazma (with some MAG-10) really helped me hold onto muscle and strength during that horrible bout.

I noticed that once I got better and was able to tear it up in the gym, that my results with micro-PA was actually better when I went all Plazma pulse versus just Plazma for training and MAG-10 pulses throughout the day. Could be just a unique result for me though. And it could be I needed alot more general carbs in my diet and the Plazma pulsing was just providing that which I needed.

I had always been a “protein counter”, meaning I was always so concerned with getting a certain amount of protein in every day. MAG-10 pulses have 20 grams of casein hydrolysate di/tri-peptides, and I’m assuming Plazma has 15 grams (I don’t know if the protein number on the Plazma level is for di/tri-peptides plus the citruline malate, or it it is all casein hydrolysate), and so I gravitated towards the higher “protein” number product thinking I can simply add in carbs myself. It’s funny, I now no longer pay any attention to total protein gram intake anymore.


#6

[quote]Chris Shugart wrote:
Most <a href="http://www.T-Nation.com/store/products/plazma"target=“new”>Plazma users are former users of our previous workout nutrition products, like Surge, and they’ll usually tell you that Plazma is far superior and noticeably better. Of course, if someone has never used workout nutrition and they go straight to Plazma, their results seem “magical” because they have filled in a major gap with the best possible supplement.

There are many supplements and ingredients being sold out there that claim to be the same as what’s in Plazma. But the fact is, there is simply no way for that to be true. Why? Because they charge less than what the quality raw ingredients cost. Now, you tell me: are they running a charity or are they doing some funny business with their labels and ingredient claims? I think this is one reason why people find Plazma and other Biotest supplements to be so superior and work so much better: you’re actually getting large amounts of the best ingredients. With other supplements, you’re getting waste products claiming to be the real thing, or they’re using the quality ingredients but not enough of them to have an effect on the body (or they’re adding “filler” and not claiming that on the label - a popular ruse of cheaper supplements, especially proteins.)

As for the water content, Tim Patterson has studied and tested this extensively: the amount of water called for is the amount that’s needed for you to get the most out of the supplement. Again, I suppose many supplement companies would not let the customer know this because they know that some people won’t want to drink that much. Tim would rather you get the best results possible, so the water amounts called for reflect that. [/quote]

Chris, I am hoping that you did not take my comments in a negative fashion, this was not my intent. I know that Biotest produces quality products; hence the reason I use your products. For example I know I can get bulk L- Leuncine cheaper, but after using your Luecine product I will continue. After using Hydrolyzed products in the past you never forget the taste. I can tell your Leucine product is a higher quality that other raw L- Leucine products.

I have been revisiting some of my old muscle mags from the 90’s (a bit of nostalgia and also fun to revisit what is still relevant vs. bogus information at the time). It is very interesting to see all the old advertisements and realized that 75% of the supplement companies back in the day are no longer in existence. Biotest has stood the test of time and that is something to consider for anyone out there who is in search of cheaper supplements.

I am trying the Indigo 3g product for the first time and after doing this for 20 plus years, I am amazed at the results. I have become very jaded with marketing and advertising in the supplement market (a lot of smoke and mirrors). I am happy to say that Indigo is a very solid addition to my supplement line. When I start my bulking phase in the fall I plan on using the Micro-PA product to see what results I can accomplish.


#7

[quote]burndaddy0 wrote:

[quote]Chris Shugart wrote:
Most <a href="http://www.T-Nation.com/store/products/plazma"target=“new”>Plazma users are former users of our previous workout nutrition products, like Surge, and they’ll usually tell you that Plazma is far superior and noticeably better. Of course, if someone has never used workout nutrition and they go straight to Plazma, their results seem “magical” because they have filled in a major gap with the best possible supplement.

There are many supplements and ingredients being sold out there that claim to be the same as what’s in Plazma. But the fact is, there is simply no way for that to be true. Why? Because they charge less than what the quality raw ingredients cost. Now, you tell me: are they running a charity or are they doing some funny business with their labels and ingredient claims? I think this is one reason why people find Plazma and other Biotest supplements to be so superior and work so much better: you’re actually getting large amounts of the best ingredients. With other supplements, you’re getting waste products claiming to be the real thing, or they’re using the quality ingredients but not enough of them to have an effect on the body (or they’re adding “filler” and not claiming that on the label - a popular ruse of cheaper supplements, especially proteins.)

As for the water content, Tim Patterson has studied and tested this extensively: the amount of water called for is the amount that’s needed for you to get the most out of the supplement. Again, I suppose many supplement companies would not let the customer know this because they know that some people won’t want to drink that much. Tim would rather you get the best results possible, so the water amounts called for reflect that. [/quote]

Chris, I am hoping that you did not take my comments in a negative fashion, this was not my intent. I know that Biotest produces quality products; hence the reason I use your products. For example I know I can get bulk L- Leuncine cheaper, but after using your Luecine product I will continue. After using Hydrolyzed products in the past you never forget the taste. I can tell your Leucine product is a higher quality that other raw L- Leucine products.

I have been revisiting some of my old muscle mags from the 90’s (a bit of nostalgia and also fun to revisit what is still relevant vs. bogus information at the time). It is very interesting to see all the old advertisements and realized that 75% of the supplement companies back in the day are no longer in existence. Biotest has stood the test of time and that is something to consider for anyone out there who is in search of cheaper supplements.

I am trying the Indigo 3g product for the first time and after doing this for 20 plus years, I am amazed at the results. I have become very jaded with marketing and advertising in the supplement market (a lot of smoke and mirrors). I am happy to say that Indigo is a very solid addition to my supplement line. When I start my bulking phase in the fall I plan on using the Micro-PA product to see what results I can accomplish.
[/quote]

Just to touch on the flavor- I have had other hydrolyzed casein myself, and what should have been “Dutch chocolate” tasted instead like if you were to imagine oily boardwalk French fries getting cold and soggy- best way I can describe it. I had to order more flavoring from that company and add way more than should have been necessary, and at that point it wasn’t even pleasant, it simply made it so I could drink it without gagging.

Having said that, Plazma tastes awesome. Not compared to that other crap I ingested, but simply awesome. If you like the taste of things like Gatorade- you will LOVE Plazma. Even better- you can make the flavor more concentrated or more diluted to suit your tastes. I love the Lime flavor. Others are good of course, and I even mixed lemon and lime once I saw someone comment that it was like anabolic Sprite (not far off)…it is GOOD STUFF.

In my experience, I can taste a very, very slight hint of bitterness doing a pulse of MAG-10 with the same amount of flavoring I would use for one serving of Plazma, whereas I get none with Plazma. Plazma I can actually use less flavoring than recommended and it simply isn’t as sweet, but not bitter.

Anyway, if you still have the bitter taste of those other CH products sticking with you, try Plazma, and you will be amazed.


#8

[quote]corstijeir wrote:

[quote]burndaddy0 wrote:

First question, will I see much better results with Plazma?
[/quote]

Yes - cyclic dextrin really makes that much of a difference, plus when you factor in the rest of the formula you just can’t fully mimic it on your own.

Everyone at my gym who has switched to cyclic dextrin has noticed a huge difference, and then those that switched to Plazma noticed an even bigger difference.

[quote]burndaddy0 wrote:
Second question, why so much water with Plazma?
[/quote]

With the sodium content of Plazma you need plenty of fluid so that the sodium can facilitate the peptides in most efficiently. [/quote]

I am wondering if the sodium content in Plazma is based on the age old sodium bicarbinate (baking soda) protocol. I have used baking soda in the past with good lifting results, stomach issue normally force me to stop.

I am finally getting it; that Plazma has everyting in one suppliment.


#9

[quote]buffd_samurai wrote:
I have recently switched from MAG-10 pulses to exclusive Plazma pulses and love it. I just felt I needed more clean carbs and the kind and amount in Plazma (cyclic dextrin and isomaltulose) is so convenient. I was really sick not that long ago, and Plazma (with some MAG-10) really helped me hold onto muscle and strength during that horrible bout.

I noticed that once I got better and was able to tear it up in the gym, that my results with micro-PA was actually better when I went all Plazma pulse versus just Plazma for training and MAG-10 pulses throughout the day. Could be just a unique result for me though. And it could be I needed alot more general carbs in my diet and the Plazma pulsing was just providing that which I needed.

I had always been a “protein counter”, meaning I was always so concerned with getting a certain amount of protein in every day. MAG-10 pulses have 20 grams of casein hydrolysate di/tri-peptides, and I’m assuming Plazma has 15 grams (I don’t know if the protein number on the Plazma level is for di/tri-peptides plus the citruline malate, or it it is all casein hydrolysate), and so I gravitated towards the higher “protein” number product thinking I can simply add in carbs myself. It’s funny, I now no longer pay any attention to total protein gram intake anymore. [/quote] I did the opposite i been using MAG-10 intra for less carbs


#10

[quote]burndaddy0 wrote:

[quote]Chris Shugart wrote:
Most <a href="http://www.T-Nation.com/store/products/plazma"target=“new”>Plazma users are former users of our previous workout nutrition products, like Surge, and they’ll usually tell you that Plazma is far superior and noticeably better. Of course, if someone has never used workout nutrition and they go straight to Plazma, their results seem “magical” because they have filled in a major gap with the best possible supplement.

There are many supplements and ingredients being sold out there that claim to be the same as what’s in Plazma. But the fact is, there is simply no way for that to be true. Why? Because they charge less than what the quality raw ingredients cost. Now, you tell me: are they running a charity or are they doing some funny business with their labels and ingredient claims? I think this is one reason why people find Plazma and other Biotest supplements to be so superior and work so much better: you’re actually getting large amounts of the best ingredients. With other supplements, you’re getting waste products claiming to be the real thing, or they’re using the quality ingredients but not enough of them to have an effect on the body (or they’re adding “filler” and not claiming that on the label - a popular ruse of cheaper supplements, especially proteins.)

As for the water content, Tim Patterson has studied and tested this extensively: the amount of water called for is the amount that’s needed for you to get the most out of the supplement. Again, I suppose many supplement companies would not let the customer know this because they know that some people won’t want to drink that much. Tim would rather you get the best results possible, so the water amounts called for reflect that. [/quote]

Chris, I am hoping that you did not take my comments in a negative fashion, this was not my intent. I know that Biotest produces quality products; hence the reason I use your products. For example I know I can get bulk L- Leuncine cheaper, but after using your Luecine product I will continue. After using Hydrolyzed products in the past you never forget the taste. I can tell your Leucine product is a higher quality that other raw L- Leucine products.

I have been revisiting some of my old muscle mags from the 90’s (a bit of nostalgia and also fun to revisit what is still relevant vs. bogus information at the time). It is very interesting to see all the old advertisements and realized that 75% of the supplement companies back in the day are no longer in existence. Biotest has stood the test of time and that is something to consider for anyone out there who is in search of cheaper supplements.

I am trying the Indigo 3g product for the first time and after doing this for 20 plus years, I am amazed at the results. I have become very jaded with marketing and advertising in the supplement market (a lot of smoke and mirrors). I am happy to say that Indigo is a very solid addition to my supplement line. When I start my bulking phase in the fall I plan on using the Micro-PA product to see what results I can accomplish.
[/quote]

Everytime I try to save a buck it always comes back to bite my a s s. Not just with supplements with everything. And I agree you can tell the Biotest quality just from looking at it. But the products are actually reasonable for what you’re getting. 2 pounds of bulk peptopro will cost you 60 bucks plus at least 20 dollars in shipping and 1 can of MAG-10 is only 70 with free shipping and you get over 2 pounds with better quality plus flavoring. Plus those bottles are a must


#11

[quote]burndaddy0 wrote:

[quote]corstijeir wrote:

[quote]burndaddy0 wrote:

First question, will I see much better results with Plazma?
[/quote]

Yes - cyclic dextrin really makes that much of a difference, plus when you factor in the rest of the formula you just can’t fully mimic it on your own.

Everyone at my gym who has switched to cyclic dextrin has noticed a huge difference, and then those that switched to Plazma noticed an even bigger difference.

[quote]burndaddy0 wrote:
Second question, why so much water with Plazma?
[/quote]

With the sodium content of Plazma you need plenty of fluid so that the sodium can facilitate the peptides in most efficiently. [/quote]

I am wondering if the sodium content in Plazma is based on the age old sodium bicarbinate (baking soda) protocol. I have used baking soda in the past with good lifting results, stomach issue normally force me to stop.

I am finally getting it; that Plazma has everyting in one suppliment.[/quote]
Plus you dont have to use the full 3 doses. 2 is more then enough for me. I imagine 1 is enough for a lot of people


#12

[quote]dez6485 wrote:

[quote]burndaddy0 wrote:

[quote]Chris Shugart wrote:
Most <a href="http://www.T-Nation.com/store/products/plazma"target=“new”>Plazma users are former users of our previous workout nutrition products, like Surge, and they’ll usually tell you that Plazma is far superior and noticeably better. Of course, if someone has never used workout nutrition and they go straight to Plazma, their results seem “magical” because they have filled in a major gap with the best possible supplement.

There are many supplements and ingredients being sold out there that claim to be the same as what’s in Plazma. But the fact is, there is simply no way for that to be true. Why? Because they charge less than what the quality raw ingredients cost. Now, you tell me: are they running a charity or are they doing some funny business with their labels and ingredient claims? I think this is one reason why people find Plazma and other Biotest supplements to be so superior and work so much better: you’re actually getting large amounts of the best ingredients. With other supplements, you’re getting waste products claiming to be the real thing, or they’re using the quality ingredients but not enough of them to have an effect on the body (or they’re adding “filler” and not claiming that on the label - a popular ruse of cheaper supplements, especially proteins.)

As for the water content, Tim Patterson has studied and tested this extensively: the amount of water called for is the amount that’s needed for you to get the most out of the supplement. Again, I suppose many supplement companies would not let the customer know this because they know that some people won’t want to drink that much. Tim would rather you get the best results possible, so the water amounts called for reflect that. [/quote]

Chris, I am hoping that you did not take my comments in a negative fashion, this was not my intent. I know that Biotest produces quality products; hence the reason I use your products. For example I know I can get bulk L- Leuncine cheaper, but after using your Luecine product I will continue. After using Hydrolyzed products in the past you never forget the taste. I can tell your Leucine product is a higher quality that other raw L- Leucine products.

I have been revisiting some of my old muscle mags from the 90’s (a bit of nostalgia and also fun to revisit what is still relevant vs. bogus information at the time). It is very interesting to see all the old advertisements and realized that 75% of the supplement companies back in the day are no longer in existence. Biotest has stood the test of time and that is something to consider for anyone out there who is in search of cheaper supplements.

I am trying the Indigo 3g product for the first time and after doing this for 20 plus years, I am amazed at the results. I have become very jaded with marketing and advertising in the supplement market (a lot of smoke and mirrors). I am happy to say that Indigo is a very solid addition to my supplement line. When I start my bulking phase in the fall I plan on using the Micro-PA product to see what results I can accomplish.
[/quote]

Just to touch on the flavor- I have had other hydrolyzed casein myself, and what should have been “Dutch chocolate” tasted instead like if you were to imagine oily boardwalk French fries getting cold and soggy- best way I can describe it. I had to order more flavoring from that company and add way more than should have been necessary, and at that point it wasn’t even pleasant, it simply made it so I could drink it without gagging.

Having said that, Plazma tastes awesome. Not compared to that other crap I ingested, but simply awesome. If you like the taste of things like Gatorade- you will LOVE Plazma. Even better- you can make the flavor more concentrated or more diluted to suit your tastes. I love the Lime flavor. Others are good of course, and I even mixed lemon and lime once I saw someone comment that it was like anabolic Sprite (not far off)…it is GOOD STUFF.

In my experience, I can taste a very, very slight hint of bitterness doing a pulse of MAG-10 with the same amount of flavoring I would use for one serving of Plazma, whereas I get none with Plazma. Plazma I can actually use less flavoring than recommended and it simply isn’t as sweet, but not bitter.

Anyway, if you still have the bitter taste of those other CH products sticking with you, try Plazma, and you will be amazed. [/quote] I didn’t like it at first but one of the main reasons I’ll never go back to regular protein shakes other then meal replacements is because the MAG-10 is so easy to drink. It’s just like drinking water or gatorade as opposed to a milk shake.